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	<title>Comments on: How Google is putting us back into the Stone Age</title>
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	<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/</link>
	<description>vik singh&#039;s (mainly techy) thoughts</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 11:41:32 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Yuvi</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-13431</link>
		<dc:creator>Yuvi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:38:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-13431</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m late to the party, but look into WPF. They&#039;re starting to get where you (and I) want UI to be, but they&#039;re nowhere there. It is, however, a step in the right direction. Building a WPF interface to Flickr would make a LOT of jaws hit the floor....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m late to the party, but look into WPF. They&#8217;re starting to get where you (and I) want UI to be, but they&#8217;re nowhere there. It is, however, a step in the right direction. Building a WPF interface to Flickr would make a LOT of jaws hit the floor&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: James</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-7354</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Jun 2007 15:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-7354</guid>
		<description>As a developer/designer I like the state of web applications and as they are now. I like that the web is &quot;lightweight&quot; because as we are today, web applications and services are too primitive (as you pointed out) to utilize the power of my computer. But I think what you haven&#039;t covered is that while many people don&#039;t utilize a lot of their processing power, some of them, like me, do, and due to that, a sizable increase in client-side processing done for web apps and services would essentially push the envelope of high end computing up (what I have now, + extra power to accommodate the new processing requirements and my existing ones).

That aside, the web itself is not ready for the next stage of development, where we move into more stateless applications. Google Docs/Spreadsheets is a good start, and AJAX is a great tool, but JavaScript was never designed for pushing this kind of information, and current browsers aren&#039;t really suited to data intensive AJAX functions either. Before advanced web applications and advanced services that actually utilize the client as more than something of a smart terminal and utilize its data processing power appropriately can be made, the frameworks used to deliver all this over the web need to be updated with smart data delivery in mind.

Presently, I&#039;m in favour of using client side applications that handle external data themselves, in whatever proprietary method the developers felt was best suited, because currently that is the best and most efficient way, and currently there is no universal framework that can cater to everyone&#039;s needs. I&#039;m sure one will come about in time, but it&#039;s some way off yet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a developer/designer I like the state of web applications and as they are now. I like that the web is &#8220;lightweight&#8221; because as we are today, web applications and services are too primitive (as you pointed out) to utilize the power of my computer. But I think what you haven&#8217;t covered is that while many people don&#8217;t utilize a lot of their processing power, some of them, like me, do, and due to that, a sizable increase in client-side processing done for web apps and services would essentially push the envelope of high end computing up (what I have now, + extra power to accommodate the new processing requirements and my existing ones).</p>
<p>That aside, the web itself is not ready for the next stage of development, where we move into more stateless applications. Google Docs/Spreadsheets is a good start, and AJAX is a great tool, but JavaScript was never designed for pushing this kind of information, and current browsers aren&#8217;t really suited to data intensive AJAX functions either. Before advanced web applications and advanced services that actually utilize the client as more than something of a smart terminal and utilize its data processing power appropriately can be made, the frameworks used to deliver all this over the web need to be updated with smart data delivery in mind.</p>
<p>Presently, I&#8217;m in favour of using client side applications that handle external data themselves, in whatever proprietary method the developers felt was best suited, because currently that is the best and most efficient way, and currently there is no universal framework that can cater to everyone&#8217;s needs. I&#8217;m sure one will come about in time, but it&#8217;s some way off yet.</p>
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		<title>By: Serge</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-7339</link>
		<dc:creator>Serge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Jun 2007 12:18:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-7339</guid>
		<description>This post title&#039;s appropriateness, which can be made subject of a completely separate discussion, is quite irrelevant simply because &quot;never judge the book by its cover&quot; applies on the Net as well. The title was catchy, and whether you think it suits the content - you (all of you) clicked the link and read the text - so shut up.

Now, moving on to the real point made by the author. I completely agree with Vik in that we&#039;ve spent the last 10 years ramping up our CPUs, VGUs (and other components) in a bid to facilitate demanding applications. The reality is that the general consumer does not typically need 3GHz or 256mB video RAM.

Sure, we have a few savvy consumers (let&#039;s exclude the techies because, well, we can all find a way to use up 100% CPU or RAM if the challenge arises, even from Bash or Cmd) who not only manage to rotate photos but also encode videos and watch DVDs, thus successfully managing to utilise a PC like a VCR.

Most applications today are still plain old windows with static buttons and drop-down menus, and their expected output is not much more spectacular than a well crafted colourful Excel spreadsheet filled with sorted grids and meaningful numbers.

Operating system developers are of course pushing development of visually rich environments but this is happening way too slowly and probably for the wrong reasons (flashy ads are not why one should develop a good looking OS). Try convincing a small company (say 10 PCs) or even a savvy home user to upgrade to Vista. With XP SP2, free Windows Media Encoder and a bunch of other tools that they&#039;ve learnt how to use - the users today have all they need (or think they need). XP has had more its bugs fixed by now, Vista has over 100 patches to be zipped into SP1 – and users feel that grown stability of their existing OS. In contrast, an OS change = painful setting backups, document backups, reset application preferences, reinstalling of applications and most of all the fear of having to learn new ways of doing things.

What we need is a near stateless operating system, and near stateless applications. That&#039;s right, the OS should be an interface between the program you want to run, and the hardware that you have. What kind of an interface is it, if it’s irreplaceable? If you say this is technically impossible, I say - look at VMWare, Zen, Virtual PC. An OS, as far as the user is concerned is the location of his menus, and the colour of the login screen – not much else. We should be able to write applications today that run on any PC, full stop.

From a technical system administration standpoint this does present new challenges, but also new solutions to existing problems. Let’s not go into this field at this time, not because it’s not worthy, but because this post is not about this. I will be happy to discuss the implications of a stateless OS on large-scale system administration in a separate blog/discussion.

Coming back to the original point, yes, these applications will need to take care of visual presentation and other bells and whistles themselves. But so they should - each application should try to be more accessible, friendlier, and more intuitive. Why should the application developer stop at the thought that &quot;the OS will take care of all that stuff&quot;?

Only then will we have programs that obey our speech, follow our hand/glove (Minority Report reference), and present results (whatever they are) the best possible way we would want them to be presented, considering the available hardware.

Too difficult? Well, it is happening on the Web. This is where &#039;semantic web design&#039; originated. What does it mean? It means &quot;present the data in the basic form, but if the environment supports JS - use it; if it supports animations - use them; if it supports asynchronous data calls - use them; if it supports fancy visuals driven by Flash - use them!&quot; But even here we feel the lack of interaction and compatibility - why is it that we still need to use Flash to let the user see a pretty font; why is it that web developers have to write hacks for compatibility with the browser?

It is time. Time for Microsoft to include the Square Root button in the Scientific mode of Windows Calculator. Time for Linux, an environment with so much freedom and potential, to have more menus and options that the Windows Control Panel. Finally, it is time for Apple, the now permanent runner-up of Windows, to contribute to development of a stateless OS for just one reason - so more people can plug-in MacOS on their PCs (DVD, memory stick, a wireless download - who cares how - make it happen - invent).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post title&#8217;s appropriateness, which can be made subject of a completely separate discussion, is quite irrelevant simply because &#8220;never judge the book by its cover&#8221; applies on the Net as well. The title was catchy, and whether you think it suits the content &#8211; you (all of you) clicked the link and read the text &#8211; so shut up.</p>
<p>Now, moving on to the real point made by the author. I completely agree with Vik in that we&#8217;ve spent the last 10 years ramping up our CPUs, VGUs (and other components) in a bid to facilitate demanding applications. The reality is that the general consumer does not typically need 3GHz or 256mB video RAM.</p>
<p>Sure, we have a few savvy consumers (let&#8217;s exclude the techies because, well, we can all find a way to use up 100% CPU or RAM if the challenge arises, even from Bash or Cmd) who not only manage to rotate photos but also encode videos and watch DVDs, thus successfully managing to utilise a PC like a VCR.</p>
<p>Most applications today are still plain old windows with static buttons and drop-down menus, and their expected output is not much more spectacular than a well crafted colourful Excel spreadsheet filled with sorted grids and meaningful numbers.</p>
<p>Operating system developers are of course pushing development of visually rich environments but this is happening way too slowly and probably for the wrong reasons (flashy ads are not why one should develop a good looking OS). Try convincing a small company (say 10 PCs) or even a savvy home user to upgrade to Vista. With XP SP2, free Windows Media Encoder and a bunch of other tools that they&#8217;ve learnt how to use &#8211; the users today have all they need (or think they need). XP has had more its bugs fixed by now, Vista has over 100 patches to be zipped into SP1 – and users feel that grown stability of their existing OS. In contrast, an OS change = painful setting backups, document backups, reset application preferences, reinstalling of applications and most of all the fear of having to learn new ways of doing things.</p>
<p>What we need is a near stateless operating system, and near stateless applications. That&#8217;s right, the OS should be an interface between the program you want to run, and the hardware that you have. What kind of an interface is it, if it’s irreplaceable? If you say this is technically impossible, I say &#8211; look at VMWare, Zen, Virtual PC. An OS, as far as the user is concerned is the location of his menus, and the colour of the login screen – not much else. We should be able to write applications today that run on any PC, full stop.</p>
<p>From a technical system administration standpoint this does present new challenges, but also new solutions to existing problems. Let’s not go into this field at this time, not because it’s not worthy, but because this post is not about this. I will be happy to discuss the implications of a stateless OS on large-scale system administration in a separate blog/discussion.</p>
<p>Coming back to the original point, yes, these applications will need to take care of visual presentation and other bells and whistles themselves. But so they should &#8211; each application should try to be more accessible, friendlier, and more intuitive. Why should the application developer stop at the thought that &#8220;the OS will take care of all that stuff&#8221;?</p>
<p>Only then will we have programs that obey our speech, follow our hand/glove (Minority Report reference), and present results (whatever they are) the best possible way we would want them to be presented, considering the available hardware.</p>
<p>Too difficult? Well, it is happening on the Web. This is where &#8217;semantic web design&#8217; originated. What does it mean? It means &#8220;present the data in the basic form, but if the environment supports JS &#8211; use it; if it supports animations &#8211; use them; if it supports asynchronous data calls &#8211; use them; if it supports fancy visuals driven by Flash &#8211; use them!&#8221; But even here we feel the lack of interaction and compatibility &#8211; why is it that we still need to use Flash to let the user see a pretty font; why is it that web developers have to write hacks for compatibility with the browser?</p>
<p>It is time. Time for Microsoft to include the Square Root button in the Scientific mode of Windows Calculator. Time for Linux, an environment with so much freedom and potential, to have more menus and options that the Windows Control Panel. Finally, it is time for Apple, the now permanent runner-up of Windows, to contribute to development of a stateless OS for just one reason &#8211; so more people can plug-in MacOS on their PCs (DVD, memory stick, a wireless download &#8211; who cares how &#8211; make it happen &#8211; invent).</p>
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		<title>By: Ferdinand</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-6458</link>
		<dc:creator>Ferdinand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 06:51:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-6458</guid>
		<description>So this whole post comes down to: &quot;How the web fails to use your hardware&quot; 

That&#039;s a pretty misleading title and even the title you suggest afterwards is misleading. I think you should have made a post about the possibilities of using every resource the computer has to improve web applications.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So this whole post comes down to: &#8220;How the web fails to use your hardware&#8221; </p>
<p>That&#8217;s a pretty misleading title and even the title you suggest afterwards is misleading. I think you should have made a post about the possibilities of using every resource the computer has to improve web applications.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Hurst</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1822</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Hurst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Apr 2007 01:53:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1822</guid>
		<description>I liked this post. I&#039;ve been asking: do we want to build the Google Maps or the Google Earth for this space? analogy for a while as I think it is a great illustration of the points you make here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I liked this post. I&#8217;ve been asking: do we want to build the Google Maps or the Google Earth for this space? analogy for a while as I think it is a great illustration of the points you make here.</p>
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		<title>By: maarcis</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1790</link>
		<dc:creator>maarcis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:56:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1790</guid>
		<description>talking about industry standards my computer has 256 MB ram and I bought it 3 months ago, well it probably has to do everything qith me being a non-consumerist (lol) and having had necessity to buy some labware etc.
There may be lots of considerations like that.
Paraphrasing Google&#039;s mission statement - making all applications universally available is what should be pushed forward IMO.
I&#039;m not even sure about fancy interfaces - there have been periods of time when I had to rely on a cell phone browser for my web needs and frankly the idea that I can access sum of human knowledge virtually everywhere if I succeed in interpreting distorted text-only pages correctly seems very futuristic to me.
IMO accessibility is a major consideration.
Google Earth model is a nice compromise although it&#039;s a wee bit tremulous on my computer lol.
On the other hand I think Joost could force me to upgrade something.
btw you can install folding@home to make use of idle computing resources for scientific purposes, GPUs like that contribute greatly to protein folding.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>talking about industry standards my computer has 256 MB ram and I bought it 3 months ago, well it probably has to do everything qith me being a non-consumerist (lol) and having had necessity to buy some labware etc.<br />
There may be lots of considerations like that.<br />
Paraphrasing Google&#8217;s mission statement &#8211; making all applications universally available is what should be pushed forward IMO.<br />
I&#8217;m not even sure about fancy interfaces &#8211; there have been periods of time when I had to rely on a cell phone browser for my web needs and frankly the idea that I can access sum of human knowledge virtually everywhere if I succeed in interpreting distorted text-only pages correctly seems very futuristic to me.<br />
IMO accessibility is a major consideration.<br />
Google Earth model is a nice compromise although it&#8217;s a wee bit tremulous on my computer lol.<br />
On the other hand I think Joost could force me to upgrade something.<br />
btw you can install folding@home to make use of idle computing resources for scientific purposes, GPUs like that contribute greatly to protein folding.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt J</title>
		<link>http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1786</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:01:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://zooie.wordpress.com/2007/04/18/how-google-is-putting-us-back-into-the-stone-age/#comment-1786</guid>
		<description>I agree. I think the emerging solution to this might lie in Adobe Apollo, Microsoft WPF/E (Silverlight), which encourage creating web services in a desktop application context. I&#039;m not sure, however, how effective they are in utilizing the full resources of your computer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree. I think the emerging solution to this might lie in Adobe Apollo, Microsoft WPF/E (Silverlight), which encourage creating web services in a desktop application context. I&#8217;m not sure, however, how effective they are in utilizing the full resources of your computer.</p>
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